Episode 033: Patrick Alcedo

Dr. Patrick Alcedo, Chair of the Department of Dance at York University, is an award-winning filmmaker whose documentaries capture the beauty of motion and the dreams of possibility among dancers in the Philippines. His work is gorgeous and human, with carefully framed images and haunting, evocative soundtracks.

Transcript

Cameron: My guest today is Dr. Patrick Alcedo, Chair of the Department of Dance at York University. Dr. Alcedo is an award-winning filmmaker whose films capture the beauty of motion and the dreams of possibility among dancers in the Philippines. His work is gorgeous and human, with carefully framed images and haunting, evocative soundtracks. I talked to him about how he moved from dance to filmmaking, and what its like to be an artist in an academic world. I hope you enjoy our conversation…. Patrick, welcome to the podcast!

Patrick: Hello. Yeah, thank you for having me, Cam.

Cameron: It's a pleasure to be talking with you. Your work is really remarkable and I want to talk to you about some specific films that you've released. But I want to go back a little bit and just recapture some of the transitions that you made in moving from being a dancer yourself to becoming a filmmaker. Can you tell me about that journey?

Patrick: Sure. I grew up in the Philippines. I grew up dancing. I became a professional dancer in Manila. And when I was in Manila, I started falling in love with documentary films. And I really saw the power of documentary films when I was still a student and later on a very young faculty member at the University of the Philippines. So I saw the link between what it means, -- because dance is still, although it's a very embodied form, a very visual medium. And so the link there was quite immediate for me. And then when I did my PhD in California, I realized that a dissertation, a doctoral dissertation could really be more than a written text. And I was doing a lot of video documentation and I saw an organic development between the written and the film. So really, I mean, I think it's my love for the movement, it's my love for the choreography. And also, Cam, I think aside from it being a dancer, I was always an English major in the Philippines. So the power of narrative, the power of storytelling. And of course, when I did my PhD, I was trained in anthropology. So all these things that are so grounded in dance. But I wanted dance to be much more than what I was trained to be, which is a performance. So I went into documentary filmmaking.

Cameron: How did you learn the actual techniques of filmmaking?

Patrick: Well, actually, when I was in the Philippines, I was hanging out a lot with filmmakers at the University of the Philippines. I'm not a formally trained in film making. My formal training is in anthropology and research. And really my collaborator, my partner, Fruto Corre, was the one who introduced me to the world of documentary filmmaking. He was the one doing the videography. I was the one doing the research. I was the one doing the writing. So the camera work really was taken care of my colleague, in the past. I don't do the camera work. I do the research. I do the writing of it. I'm part of, very much of the editing. I did try. I did try doing the camera work, but it's very difficult to also be aware of what's happening around you and to determine what needs to be filmed when you're also holding the camera. So, when I realized that I really could not be two persons, I decided to focus on the directing and then trust somebody to do the camera work for me.

Cameron: So it's very collaborative.

Patrick: It is very collaborative. Yeah. And I'm very careful, Cam, in choosing who is the... I work with a very small team. I only work with one camera person, myself, and then an assistant that takes care of our equipment. And sometimes I do the sound. I do the sound because it's easy when you're doing the interview then you control the audio. But the camera work, I make sure that the person who's also doing the camera work, I'm working now with somebody from New York, his name is Alex Felipe, who's phenomenal. And we are always in step with what needs to be filmed. Because it's also a very much, it's a very sensitive endeavour, what to film and what not to film.

Cameron: When you say it's sensitive, do you feel that it's somehow invasive? What do you mean by sensitive?

Patrick: Yeah, because you also have to make sure that it's very collaborative. That you have the full permission. You cannot just keep on filming. There are days, like, for example, in the A Will to Dream, there are days when we would hang out with the characters or the subjects without filming. But it's not extractive. Even though you have given your permission to film, it doesn't mean that you have to film everything. So that's why you have to be sensitive to what is appropriate and what they have given you permission to film. And sometimes I even ask them, what scenarios do you think are important to be part of your narrative? So they even co-author, or co-direct a film with me.

Cameron: Right. As I've run into with many of the people I've interviewed for this podcast who are working with what the academics call "human participants.," everybody seems to have this clear understanding that the people that you're working with are your collaborators. They're not objective... They're not to be objectified. They're not passive subjects.

Patrick: Absolutely. Yeah. And I celebrate that agency. Absolutely, Cam. I celebrate that agency. There's this one moment with Dax and I said, "Dax, I mean, what do you think is important for you? This is part of your project, what do you think should be part of this film?" I said, "Oh Patrick, why don't we go to my school? I think that's important for me." With Luther, when he told me, "I think it's important for you to... I'm going to visit my partner in the Columbarium, in the cemetery. I think it's important for you to film that." So, while you are the one directing, while you are the one at the end of the day putting things together, the agency is there. Maybe because just like what you said, they're not passive subjects. It is their story at the end of the day. These are their stories and they have to have a critical role in how these stories unfold.

Cameron: Most of the people you're talking to are performers.

Patrick: Yes.

Cameron: Does this make it easier to film them?

Patrick: Yes. Yes it is. I think, oh, that's very insightful. Yes. Yes in many ways. When they are performing, when they are performing on stage, obviously, because they're trained to have that performative self. But in the quotidian, you really need the rapport, Cam. At the end of the day, it's the quotidian. I mean, I danced pretty much all my life. You take on a kind of a different persona when you're on stage. But it's the everyday life where you really need that collaboration, that long, kind of what I call in an academic language, like a diachronic approach. Like really a change across time. And you don't just parachute in. I mean, you don't just go there one time and then you finish the film. I mean, that's not the kind of film that I do. I really want the time element to be part of it. And you don't rush the story. You let it unfold the way that I think it should. Right.

Cameron: This must take some time. With a drama you can compress the time, you can film a scene and then that afternoon film a scene that's set two years later. You don't have that luxury with documentary.

Patrick: Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. Like for example, in A Will to Dream, it took maybe four years of going... Because when I'm not teaching at York, I'm always in Manila. So for the past four, maybe even five years, I would just go back to Manila and keep on filming. Keep on filming. So it took a while. And you'll see that change across time in the film itself.

Cameron: This is, I guess, a form of what in drama you'd call character development. You see these people unfolding. What else is unfolding as you're filming?

Patrick: Well, they're, for example, in the film itself, they started in an old studio that they really love. And then when I went back to Manila before the pandemic, the local government decided to tear down their old studio and put them in temporary space. So even the governmental support changes. And the practice of their art also changes. And of course the politics in the Philippines also change. So, that's one. The shift of Jon-Jon from being a student to being a teacher. Another character, for example, Justin, when I started doing the work there, he was not a major dancer. And then when he finished the film he became like one of the stars in the film. One of the stars in the group. So, even the roles in the dance repertoire or in the school change. And then another one that I really was able to -- again, this development that happened -- is the sign of hope that this program gives. And the change there that is indicated is when we went to Hong Kong and then filmed one of the students of Luther's who actually made it to the Hong Kong Disneyland. So I think the changes indicated by the hope that dance can give. The positive change that dance can give to a dancer.

Cameron: They Call Me Dax is a short documentary?

Patrick: Yes.

Cameron: Can you tell me about that?

Patrick: Yeah. They Call Me Dax is focused on the 15 year old dancer. Her name is Dorothy. Her friends fondly call her Dax and I'll never forget the first time I met her and said hi. In the Philippines, Cam, they call you "sir." Everybody, "sir." "Hi, sir." "Hi sir, my name is Dorothy." And Luther, the teacher, would ask them, "Okay, we have a visitor today. Please say hello to him." And then they all go, "Hi, sir. Hi, sir. Hi, sir." And they do this. So I'm Sir Patrick in the Philippines. And so, when she came up to me and said, "Hi, sir, I'm Dorothy, but my friends called me Dax." And I said, "Wow, that really struck me." And a major dancer, a major dancer in the group, a beautiful dancer, Cam. Oh my goodness, just a beautiful dancer. So I thought that I could really focus on Dax precisely because I was moved by her dancing and her talent. And then in doing the work, in doing the filming, I found out that she actually lives alone. Her mother lives in another city. She commutes almost an hour each way just to go to the studio. But at the same time, very, very persevering. Like she said, "Whatever happens, I'm going to continue dancing." So the spirit, the will to keep on going really moved me. So, yeah, it's a short documentary. It's a 10 minute documentary. And she's also one of the major characters, if you will, collaborators in the big film, in the feature film, A Will to Dream.

Cameron: Tell me about that one.

Patrick: A Will to Dream is a 95 minute film that is anchored in the life of Luther Perez. Luther is the teacher, their teacher. Actually the original title, Cam, was Luther's World. And he said, "No, I don't want that title. I don't want the title. It's not just me, it is everybody else." Again, inspired by his altruism to help the marginalized, a superstar ballet dancer gave up his US green card, which is a dream for most Filipinos and decided to go back to the Philippines and continue the work that he had started with his late partner. So, it is anchored in his giving hope and giving dreams to his students, continuing -- again -- continuing of the good work, change across time. And then also a story of his students. So I was able to, I decided, it's like webbing. Webbing of characters. So there's a six year old dancer, Princess; Dax, you've mentioned; Jon-Jon, his assistant teacher; Justin, another dancer; Rafael, In Hong Kong. So it's a webbing, it's a webbing of his students. Of the people he influenced and trained and I think gave the will to dream, hopefully to be lifted out of poverty.

Cameron: You're working in a web of your own here because you're inhabiting an academic world, you're participating in the world of the dancers, and you're also circulating amongst the stars of the documentary film world at these various film festivals. Tell me about how those different pieces of your life fit together. What's the importance of the academic work in informing the rest of it? What does it matter about these prizes and film festivals? How does that affect the work that you do? Can you describe all that?

Patrick: Well, yes, I will try. [laughs]

Cameron: Just a small question.

Patrick: Just a small question. I've always felt, and I decided to become an academic that my work is going to be accessible. And it's going to be public as much as I could. And I think that's the reason why I went into filmmaking is because there is -- in the same way that you're doing podcasts -- it's because there is that kind of publicizing or making it public. And I believe that they compliment each other. They compliment amongst each other. They don't cancel out each other. There are ways of presenting research that is emotionally moving. There are, when I go to festivals, it is great that they get disseminated that way, but that's not my only goal. I mean, my goal is not only to make it to festivals, but also hopefully to also affect government support, to also bring attention to the importance of dance. And I think one thing that's great about York is that we value research dissemination. So this is my response to it. That we're not in an ivory tower anymore. The community engagement is very important. And I want to contribute much to that.

Cameron: How do you know if your films have made a difference?

Patrick: Well, for example, in my, I don't really believe in very big things. Like, they don't have to be -- like, for example, in this film, A Will to Dream, there is, I think because of the attention that it's garnering, there is more intention in the government to keep on funding the program. That's the sense that I'm getting. There are more students because of the social media, there are more students that are interested in looking into dance. That's what Luther has been telling me, that they are getting additional interest because it was very difficult for them in the beginning to recruit students into their program. There's a small thing in a previous film of mine about care givers, the one before A Will to Dream. The father of one of the major characters in the film saw the film and then realized that his daughter's life in Canada is actually very difficult. And then he said that, "Oh my goodness. I didn't realize that I keep on asking for money from my daughter thinking that it's easy to get money in Canada. But after watching this film, I realize that life actually in Canada as a caregiver is different." So I think these little things from my experience with A Piece of Paradise, in my earlier film, and then in this new film in terms of the increased involvement in the arts, and hopefully a more permanent commitment to the government to support dance that will benefit the ones who are in the margins of society, will happen. So I think an answer, Cam, to your question is that, it's very difficult to quantify. But I'm hoping that it will inspire, even inspire, other students -- especially those in the margins -- to look into dance. To look into dance. And also, the film is going to be screened in the city where it was shot, and I heard that government officials will watch the film, so hopefully it will wake them up. That this is a very important project for us to keep and for us to support continuously. So that's what I'm hoping for.

Cameron: I'd like to learn more about the relationship that you develop with the people you're filming, the impact that they have on you over the long haul and maybe what impact this whole exercise of being part of this film might have on their own lives.

Patrick: I mean, I'm always very aware, I've always been very aware of my being in many ways "an outsider" into this community. I mean, I'm not from the elite in the Philippines. I could say that I'm from a lower middle class in the Philippines. But at the same time, my being in Canada as a professor in Canada, I think signals a lot of things. I've always been aware of that. And that's why I really believe in showing commitment to the work. And I always spend a lot of time in that world. Definitely it affects me and confirms to me that these are just the kinds of stories that I want to put a spotlight on. Because, number one, I look at dance not just as, obviously, not as a form of entertainment, but as a very empowering tool. It just keeps on reminding me in many ways how important it is what I'm doing. For Dax, for Luther, I think it puts them in a spotlight. It gives them the kind of visibility. Like Dax would always say, "Oh my goodness, I'm so famous now." I'm like when I go to school, because they're all on Facebook and it is like, "Oh my goodness, Dax, can I get an autograph from you?" And Luther, when he goes to the Cultural Center of the Philippines, they said, "Oh my goodness, Luther, you're the ...", like this. So it gives them that kind of, I don't know if the right word is gravitas. It gives them that kind of weight that is not negative. It also celebrates who they are, I guess. It reminds them that, oh my goodness, I mean, it's not easy to do dance. So, I think the impact for them hopefully, hopefully will continuously be positive. Rafael in Hong Kong would always say that, "Your filming this, your filming my life, also gives me value as a person. That somebody has taken notice of my narrative." So, I think the impact definitely -- hopefully, I don't know -- I mean, it's empowering and positive.

Cameron: There's something, you use the word gravitas there. There's something about the academic gaze that contributes to legitimizing something as worthy of our attention. Whether it's dancers or mothers or caregivers.

Patrick: Correct. Yeah. Yeah, it is... Yeah, definitely. I mean, as I said, I'm not innocent of my role as an academic. Especially as a Filipino scholar now working in Canada. But I hope that the kind of storytelling that I do and the kind of collaboration that I do, and the amount of time that I do, what is important, what will be foregrounded are these really inspiring stories. And I think what I'm trying to do, Cam, is to bring the kinds of resources that I have access to. To foreground or to put a spotlight on these stories that I think are incredible, and so important to tell, and from the point of view of dance. So I think that's where I'm trying to bridge is that I have a Social Sciences and Humanities Research Grant. And why don't I use that to bring these stories to life, right? Why don't I work so hard to get another grant in order for me to finish this film or something like this. Right? So, while I am ... I think that's my way of trying to bridge what I have access to and the stories that for me are very important.

Cameron: Your work also trickles out into the world through teaching. You received York University's highest teaching award, the President's Teaching Award in 2019. Tell me about the kinds of courses that you teach and the approach that you have to them.

Patrick: Yeah. Well, I teach all in dance. We have a PhD program, we have an MA program, and we have the undergrad. So I teach Dance Studies courses. I dance, I teach research methods. I teach dance ethnography. I teach Philippine dance, a studio. So I also wear that hat. So I teach in the lecture hall, in seminars, in dancing spaces. I always try to, and I don't know, Cam, I mean, in the Philippines when you finish your undergrad and they see that you could be invited. So I started teaching at the age of 20 in the university. So I've always, I think through the years, I've always pursued teaching. But to your question is that, my teaching philosophy has always been around bringing the best out of my students. And I think that's how simple it is. I always see, what can I give them? And they're here, it's my responsibility to really try my very best to show them what else they could do. And I guess that cuts across dance and research and studies. And I'm such a cheerleader, you know what I mean? Such a cheerleader. I said, "Yes, you can still do it. Yes, you can do that." But I guess the crux is, yeah, that sentence. I try to bring the best version or versions of themselves. That's really what I've always pursued even when I was in Manila teaching.

Cameron: You're giving them a will to dream.

Patrick: Yes. Yes. That's it. You got it. Yeah. Yeah.

Cameron: We'll have to, this podcast is not enough. We'll have to get a film crew following you.

Patrick: Somebody said that, Cam, somebody actually said that. That maybe you also need to be a documentary film yourself. Your own life as a, I don't know, as an academic. Wearing these multiple hats.

Cameron: Patrick, I would pay good money to see that film.

Patrick: Thank you. Thank you.

Cameron: It's been such a pleasure to talk to you. Thank you for taking the time to be on the show and I look forward to having a chance to meet you in person once we have, I think we're going to be back on campus pretty soon. In the new year.

Patrick: Yeah, that's what they say. In the new year. Yeah. And then the numbers are looking good. And the-

Cameron: We can always hope.

Patrick: We can always hope. Yes. We can always hope. But yeah, to that, I, yeah, I'm also looking forward to meeting you in person, Cam, hopefully in the winter.

Cameron: Thank you. All right. Talk to you then.

Trailer for Dr. Alcedo’s documentary, They Call Me Dax, winner of the Best Documentary Short award at the 2021 Cannes Cinema Awards.

Links

Patrick Alcedo’s faculty webpage

Patrick’s IMDB page

Credits

Host and producer: Cameron Graham
Production assistant: Andrew Castillo
Photos: York University
Music: Musicbed
Tools: Squadcast, Audacity
Recorded: November 3, 2021
Location: Toronto